• Registered: 2008-11-05
  • Posts: 111

Topic: Examples of clays

1) Zini
http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … Y1NzJ8NjQw
http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … Y2Mjd8NjQw

late-70's~mid-80's had some greatest Zini ever, mostly from no.4 mine, above 2 pics are famous factory-1 early-Pin Zini. Lots of black dots, evenly has huge black one that indicates early-Pin Zini, some white dots, solid and tender, shines like jade when seasoned.

2) Luni
http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … Y4NjR8ODAw

grand master Lu Yao Chen's, most famous 70's~80's no.4 mine Ben Shan Luni, factory-1 used it seldomely, this pot is owned by famous collector named Li Ming

http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … cyMDd8ODAw

where it came from, I don't know, it's either from no.4 or Taixi, another example of good Ben Shan Luni

http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … J8MTAyNA==
made in 1984, tribute to chairman Deng Xiao Ping, looks like China's greatest Ben Shan

Good Ben Shan Luni is like above, dense, very tendor, it's like Zhuni, no-mesh particles, it also shrinks highly

3) Hongni

http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … c2Mzh8NjQw

made in late-Qing~early-ROC, export to Thailand, this period had lots of gold/silver decorated Zhuni to Thailand. What's noticeable is its clay,  Zhaozhuang Zhuni, one of most famous ones, no other Zhuni I  know of has brighter and stronger orange tone than this type. Shrinks 30~40%, during ROC it was little, by CR it's almost gone.

http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … c5Mjd8MjQw

Also Zhaozhang, made by Gu Jingzhou in 30's.

http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … gwNDB8ODAw

Mt. Huanglong original Hongni, notice its silver dots, some black dots. Factory-1 added iron oxide to it, becomes cleaner but silver dots left, some called it Xiao Hongni. Hongnis originally have extra dots like above, so factory-1 used to add iron oxide, made it brighter orange tone.

http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/l … g1MTJ8NjQw

Xiao Mei Yao Zhuni, XMY has various types, from what I know it's mined since 50's then mined more in 70~80's, stopped in 90's. Above looks it's fired at low temperature but XMY can have pronounced red color as well. Good XMY shrinks high around 2~30%, it and Zhaozhuang Zhuni give a fear to potters, because this rate of shrinkage might burst pot in a kiln and even it survives, shape will be very different than before it was fired.

一杯一杯復一杯
  • Registered: 2010-04-21
  • Posts: 6

Re: Examples of clays

Extremely helpful post Charles! Thanks for taking the time to post this info. Perhaps you could add some pics of exemplary zisha here too? I know that zisha is not technically "clay" but I think it would be helpful to see it compared to zini- especially Quingshuini.

  • Registered: 2008-11-05
  • Posts: 111

Re: Examples of clays

tingjunkie wrote:

Extremely helpful post Charles! Thanks for taking the time to post this info. Perhaps you could add some pics of exemplary zisha here too? I know that zisha is not technically "clay" but I think it would be helpful to see it compared to zini- especially Quingshuini.

once again, I didn't quite get your question, hehe. Above pics I thought are exemplary ones so I posted. There are too many Zishas so it's impossible to post all, my intention was to show how old ones look like. Above ones are super-quality one, not easily purchasable from markets..

一杯一杯復一杯
  • Registered: 2010-04-21
  • Posts: 6

Re: Examples of clays

I think there is confusion over my use of the term "zisha." I was under the impression that zisha is a particular type of purple sand/clay. I have also heard others use the term to apply to ANY type of Yixing clay. Are the terms zisha and zini interchangeable? If not, can you describe the difference? Thanks.

  • Registered: 2008-11-05
  • Posts: 111

Re: Examples of clays

tingjunkie wrote:

I think there is confusion over my use of the term "zisha." I was under the impression that zisha is a particular type of purple sand/clay. I have also heard others use the term to apply to ANY type of Yixing clay. Are the terms zisha and zini interchangeable? If not, can you describe the difference? Thanks.

now I understand, hehe.

http://www.fotobada.com/bongnam0/foto/link/NjczMHwwMDR8Ym9uZ25hbTB8MTgxODk1fDEyNzIwMzMzMDl8NjQw

Yixing clay mountain is called Yellow Dragon mountain, which is mainly yellow, now it's no more mountain all clays are used up that it is just plain and pond. Then there was purpleish spot (Jia ni), inside had Yixing clay. The picture indicates Jia Ni layer and some yixing clays in Chinese.

Zisha meant Zini, cos Zini was most common Yixing clay but now it means hongni, duanni all of Yixing clay. So Zisha = Yixing clay, in nowadays understanding. The Chinese way of sorting clays is not as logical and scentific, haha. And Yixing clay is not from Yellow Dragon mt. alone, many Duanni comes from Bao mt. and Zhuni comes from Zhaozhuang area whichi is west of Yellow Dragon mt. they are all superior yixing clays. Nowadays clays are coming from their surrounding areas, regions, even areas under construction..

一杯一杯復一杯
  • Registered: 2010-04-21
  • Posts: 6

Re: Examples of clays

Yes that clears things up a great deal. Thanks! From my understanding, Qing Shui Ni and Di Cao Qing are two types of zi ni which are not mixed but pure clays. Is there a pure clay one would simply call "zi ni", or is all basic zi ni actually "pin zi ni." Many of the dealers who sell pots to the English speaking market will call one pot zi ni, and call another pot zi sha. Perhaps they are using the term zi sha to refer to pure zi ni?

  • Registered: 2008-11-05
  • Posts: 111

Re: Examples of clays

tingjunkie wrote:

Yes that clears things up a great deal. Thanks! From my understanding, Qing Shui Ni and Di Cao Qing are two types of zi ni which are not mixed but pure clays. Is there a pure clay one would simply call "zi ni", or is all basic zi ni actually "pin zi ni." Many of the dealers who sell pots to the English speaking market will call one pot zi ni, and call another pot zi sha. Perhaps they are using the term zi sha to refer to pure zi ni?

Qing Shui Ni just means 'pure clay', Di Cao Qing kinda means 'clay from deep inside', there's no dictionary on clay term and meaning differs day by day, by today's standards,

Zi Ni - one of three majoy Yixing clay (along with red (Hongni) and yellow (Duanni), so it imples DCQ and QSN as well, but nowadays people tends to call darker clay that is not QSN or DCQ.

Qing Shui Ni - pure clay, color is lighter than other Zi ni, mostly mined from middle parts of ore, back then the amount was so many, so nicknamed 'Pu Ni' - normal clay.

Di Cao Qing - mined from deep inside, heavy and pure part of ore, color tends to be halfway between Qing Shui Ni and Zi Ni

Pin Zi Ni - mixed Zi Ni

Zi Sha - Yixing clay (as a whole)

once again, there's no dictionary on clay term, but people just tend to call by color these days I'm noticing, they are not so hard at calling them except for Di Cao Qing, because Di Cao Qing is rare clay.

While Qing Shui Ni tends to be simpler and cheaper, there are so many kinds of Zi Ni however,

like Zi Jia Ni, Tian Qing Ni, Qing Hui Ni, Te Pin Zi Ni, Tie Sha Ni, Hei Xing Ni,


and the term itself, history is not so long, most of them don't go more than factory-1 year (55~97), serious clay study just started since 80's. Before that, terms were created by clay manufacturers and miners and potters, not officially. Then with Factory-1 and heavy followers of Yixing collectors from Taiwan made em as nowadays.

一杯一杯復一杯
  • Registered: 2010-04-21
  • Posts: 6

Re: Examples of clays

Ahhh... it's all becoming clearer now. :)

So if you were to look at the following pot listed as "zisha," what type of clay would you guess that it is? A specific type of zi ni, or just regular pin zi ni? (I could always email Hou De of course, but I would love to get your input too.) http://www.houdeasianart.com/index.php? … ts_id=1227

  • Registered: 2008-11-05
  • Posts: 111

Re: Examples of clays

tingjunkie wrote:

Ahhh... it's all becoming clearer now. :)

So if you were to look at the following pot listed as "zisha," what type of clay would you guess that it is? A specific type of zi ni, or just regular pin zi ni? (I could always email Hou De of course, but I would love to get your input too.) http://www.houdeasianart.com/index.php? … ts_id=1227

Would like to take a closer look, but so far I'm feeling that is common Zini. Looks like Duanni Tiao Sha (duanni particles evenly), but that and Pin Zini is different.

Mixed Zini - Pin Zini wasn't very oftenly seen before late-70's,

no special type, just Zini I'm thinking

一杯一杯復一杯
  • Registered: 2010-04-21
  • Posts: 6

Re: Examples of clays

Thanks again for sharing your knowledge chrl42. I've learned a lot from this thread!